DOMestic Bdsm and Female Domination

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C: Is kink really fair for most Women?
From: "Christine" at u4ds.com
Date: Fri, 13 Mar 2009 17:18:10 -0000

Hello,

In "dominant woman - only in a drunken stupor", Nuked Potatoes
expresses the idea that kink is not really fair for most women.

Does it matter? I doubt that most men are kinky, so kink doesn't
need to be "fair for most women".

I don't think we need to concern ourselves with "most" people.
Because in developing a relationship between any couple, there
are only two people that matter.

I'm sure that many men are kinky, perhaps it is true that most
have some form of fetish, however mild? The psychological
literature, such as it is, seems to suggest that men do seem to
be more predisposed to fetishism. So perhaps there are more
kinky men than women? But, if that's true, don't let that deter
you.

I'm a dominant and demanding person but I'm not a naturally
kinky person. I don't think I'd ever had a kinky thought until I
met David. I certainly don't recall any.

David is just about as kinky a person as I've ever met, and
although he has a somewhat dominant personality, he is not
naturally a sexually dominant person. Sex mad perhaps, but not a
natural dominant in the dom/sub sense.

Being both sex mad and kinky, David was best suited to the
submissive role with me, and he knew himself and expressed that
idea from the outset of our relationship. For the 30 years
(since 1979) that we've been together, I have been (to use
David's phraseology) either dominantly kinky or kinkily
dominant, I'm not sure which. Perhaps both?

I've had a lot of fun with kinkiness. It's been a joy to involve
myself with those things that David is passionate about. Just as
David has enjoyed involving himself with those things that I'm
passionate about. That's what can happen in a loving
partnership. A couple can share and enjoy the things that their
partner enjoys.

The trick, it seems to me, is in finding a partner who you love,
and who loves you. To do that requires communicating openly,
preferably from the outset, about who you are. How can your
partner truly love you if they don't know who you are?

If it helps Nuked or any one else who has yet to find their
partner. I'd just like to point out that David and I did not
meet online or through contact ads. We didn't meet in a club or
discotheque, or through any organisation connected with kinky
interests. We met, like most folk probably do, in the
conventional manner through business and personal contacts.

If it's true that most women are not naturally or automatically
attracted to kink, then it might be best not to go looking for a
partner in the kinky scene. She (or he) may not be looking
there.

But once having a met a potential partner who you like a lot, if
you don't give that person a chance to know your kinky self,
you'll never find a partner who may love you for who you are,
and who may also want to share your kink with you.

sincerely,
Christine

The Fem Dom Training Software.
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C: men who top from the bottom - submissive or not?
Date: Thu, 12 Mar 2009 14:23:21 -0000
From: Mistress P /sub_arub

Is he or isn't he?

I have two questions for the group, and am seeking responses
from experienced female dominants:

Is it possible that submissive men who top from the bottom don't
realize they are doing it (if left uncorrected)?

And if the submissive continues to top from the bottom, even
after being corrected a number of times, would you say he is
truly a submissive?

Mistress P

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Re: C: men who top from the bottom - submissive or not?
Date: 12 Mar 2009 23:08:54 -0000
From: MichaelK

What is topping from the bottom?

In Devotional Sex the couple are more a partnership than
traditional FemDom. So, unless told otherwise by his Princess,
there is nothing wrong with a Knight saying:

Would you like a foot massage?
How about we go to bed for a cuddle?
Can I have a Devotional Cuddle?
Would you like me to Reveal?
Can I give you oral sex?
Can I sit at your feet?

In Devotional Sex most of what is done might arise from a
Knight's suggestions!

This all gives the Princess ideas of what to do next, and tells
her what her Knight is thinking.

But absolutely nothing happens unless the Princess says "yes".

Princess Power is very real because a Princess will not always
say "yes". Sometimes she will be inspired by a suggestion to do
something else. And of course all of her "suggestions" do
happen.

As long as the Princess never feels forced or pressured to do
something she is always the person with the power. And both feel
and know this.

Devotional Sex is mild FemDom (which is one reason it is
suitable for non-dominant women). And it does not aim for the
male to be a "true submissive". So I'm not suggesting that the
more partnership like style of Devotional Sex is best for
traditional strong FemDom couples.

But in a strong FemDom relationship does a Mistress really want
a sub who never makes suggestions? Does she really want a sub
that never shares with her how he would like to please her?

And as I believe that all relationships will only work if both
get enough out of what happens to want to continue, is it wrong
for a sub to let his Mistress know what he would like?

Even in Devotional Sex a Knight's suggestions are never a
command which his Princess must obey. A Knight cannot make
something happen.

Is it ever the case that topping from the bottom does mean the
sub / Knight takes control?

Or does topping from the bottom just mean that the sub / Knight
is making too many suggestions?

Cheers,
MichaelK

PS Thanks to all those who visited my site after my earlier
posting. I hope some of you liked what you found.

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C: Baroness Sacher-Masoch - Masochism trivia
From: "Christine" at u4ds.com
Date: 9 Mar 2009 18:46:19 -0000

Hello,

A piece of trivia for those interested in the origin of the word
Masochism.

Marianne Faithfull's maternal great-great-uncle was Leopold von
Sacher-Masoch, the famous 19th century Austrian nobleman whose
erotic novel, "Venus in Furs", spawned the word "masochism"

This piece of trivial information was not known to me until I
saw Marianne Faithfull interviewed on the BBC's Andrew Marr show
yesterday when she mentioned that although she has inherited her
title of Baroness, she doesn't actually use it.

Marian Evelyn Faithfull is Marianne Faithfull's name by birth,
and her mother was Baroness Eva Erisso von Sacher-Masoch. Her
father, Major Dr. Robert Glynn Faithfull, was a British military
officer and college professor in psychology.

Wikipedia mentions that Marianne Faithfull commented in March,
2007, "I'm even going to Budapest, which is nice because I'm
half English and half Austro-Hungarian. I've inherited the title
Baroness Sacher-Masoch - it comes from one of my great uncles
who gave his name to masochism."

Marianne Faithfull makes peace with her past
What I know about men - by Marianne Faithfull

sincerely,
Christine at u4ds.com

The DOMestic discussion list. Now in our thirteenth year. The
password site now has over 6,700 files with well over 400
stories, plus pictures, and hundreds of articles. $26.99 for a
one year password. $16.99 for six months at

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Re: C: dominant woman - only in a drunken stupor
Date: Fri, 6 Mar 2009 19:56:05 -0800 (PST)
From: MsLynn

Darryl (nuked_potatoes) wrote:

>Forever i have looked for this woman and only in a drunken
>stupor can i find anything close.

Sadly, an old phrase whose author I don't recall comes to mind,
"whether you think you can or you think you can't, you're
right." This is one of those occasions.

I and the many dominant women I know will neither cease to exist
nor pound down doors to prove ourselves.

Darryl (and anyone else who shares your opinion)
I wish you well.

MsLynn

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Re: C: dominant woman - only in a drunken stupor
Date: 9 Mar 2009 18:01:14 -0000
From: MrSwitch

Moving away from particular kinks and roles.

I think a lot of frustrated 'sub' men I know really just want to
be with a lover who is as dominant with them as a vanilla man is
with a vanilla woman.

Which many people see as quite kinky!

For me it is all about mutuality. And I am very up front about
that in relationships. I have met many women who find this
liberating.

But they have to be dominant according to who they are. Not some
male fantasy.

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Re: C: dominant woman - only in a drunken stupor
Date: Wed, 11 Mar 2009 10:17:45 -0700 (PDT)
From: Miss Stress

Darryl (nuked_potatoes) wrote:

>There is no such thing as a dominant female. I have to say it
>because it is how it is for me. There is no woman that does
>not want what she dreams and that is a man to care for her.
>There is nothing we can do about being a man, it is what it
>is. I ask myself who am i talking to? And of course it is
>myself.

Hmmm, is this the same nuked that I have chatted with for the
past several years? I do believe that I am a dominant woman, who
desires to do many wonderfully wicked things to men (and have
done them as well and enjoyed *e-v-e-r-y* minute while I was
doing it. Dominant women do exist, they just aren't hanging on a
"Dominant Female purchasing Tree" for you to just walk up and
pluck us away to the house.

>I want to tell the men though, there is no such woman that can
>release you from being a man. We must do our best with what we
>have and be proud as a man.

And why would I want to? I like men. I like men who choose to
submit to me. I don't look for, nor will I tolerate, a man who
feels as though he has to be "made" to submit. I don't tolerate
rebellious submissives either. I want my submissive partner to
reach his full potential in life not only with me as my partner,
but in all aspects of his life - work, leisure time, fatherhood,
everything.

>Forever i have looked for this woman and only in a drunken
>stupor can i find anything close.

Then maybe you might want to re-evaluate what it is you are
looking for. It's easy to say "I want a dominant woman." But it
is extremely difficult to say "I want a dominant female who is
into cross dressing, forced masturbation, who shackles me to the
bed at night and makes me sleep on the floor at her feet, and
will make me eat 'cum pops' every night." The more you know
about yourself, and about what it is that you want from a
relationship, the easier it makes it on finding what you want.

>It is because no woman came into life like this, even if she
>wants to be she cannot. Even if you want her to be she cannot.
>You can have her fuck You up the ass and she may like it but
>it is not what she needs or wants. It is the real truth of the
>matter we must be men and it is ok if you are gay or something
>like that for your woman. But you will never have a dominant
>woman they don't exist without a man. Women who were hurt or
>misled will argue with me for a brief moment but the truth is
>a woman wants a man.

Hell yeah I want a man. However, a man is NOT what makes me who
I am. I AM a dominant female, I have spent *way* too many years
kissing frogs to find my prince, and I'm still kissing the
frogs. I didn't wake up one morning and think to myself, "Oh,
gee, I think I'm going to go find me a punk to turn into my
bitch." My mother was ruler in my household growing up. Dad did
not argue with her, he did not berate her, she did not argue
with him or berate him either. Mom never mistreated my father,
yet she worked outside the home, while dad stayed home and
raised my brother and myself, he cooked and cleaned the house,
and did everything a good little houseboy did. My mother taught
me by example to become the dominant woman I am. This is not
kink for me, it is a lifestyle, and one I am pleased with and
wouldn't have any other way for my life.

>But a dominant woman can only achieve that if she has a man.
>There is nothing you can do about it, if you are a lesser man
>she may be content and grateful. But it will never be her
>passion. So there is no point in any of it really.

LOL. No point? Oh, there is a point honey. What would the point
be to simply fall in love? Love. What is the point of having
sex? feeling good, endorphines, release. What is the point in
having children? To truly know unconditional love, pride, joy,
contentment, peace. What is the point of working? That one's
easy - To have money to afford various things.

So what is the point of pursuing a D/s relationship? To find
that one (or more) special person(s) to find peace, contentment,
security, partnership, love, and whatever emotions/feelings one
seeks from a relationship. However, I do not *need* a man to
make me dominant, I AM dominant. I only need a man in my life to
involve myself in the few kink activities that I do enjoy, and
even then I don't *need* - I simply *want* him there.

Sincerely,
Saber

Miss Stress

"Vocabulary enables us to interpret and to express. If you have
a limited vocabulary, you will also have a limited vision and a
limited future." - Jim Rohn

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Re: C: dominant woman - only in a drunken stupor
From: "Tony Kennedy"
Date: Thu, 12 Mar 2009 18:24:22 -0000

David.

Your response was excellent. I agreed with every word.

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Re: C: dominant woman - only in a drunken stupor
Date: Thu, 12 Mar 2009 23:37:56 -0700 (PDT)
From: nuked potatoes

Hello Ms Christine And david,

I thought of the same thing when David wrote:

>The result is that you would be drunk and tired at the bottom of
>the hole with an empty bottle.

>Would you conclude that because you had found no gold, silver,
>or other precious metal during your dig, that precious metals
>don't exist?

I thought... exactly! i spend all my money on Women and Whiskey!
and the rest i waste :-) i tease and smile Ms Christine and
David of course :-)

i wrote that post in earnest (and i can't find Ms Tiger's email
i am so lame still...) However drunken stupor or not... (~wink~
to Ms Christine) I don't think kink (Dominant Women definition
should be discussed here) is really fair for most Women.

Even professional Dommes are in great need to be accepted, it is
not what they want or love, they are hard about love because
they were hurt. They claim power but it is not their true love,
like any of us..... and like all men they need to love. So again
i say there is no such thing as a dominant woman.

nuked_potatoes a.k.a darryl

geocities.com/nuked_potatoes/

Imagination is more important than knowledge - Einstein

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Re: C: dominant woman - only in a drunken stupor
Date: Fri, 13 Mar 2009 16:09:28 -0000
From: "David" at u4ds.com

Hello Nuked Potatoes / Darryl ,

you wrote:

>exactly!

Yes, but you only quoted two paragraphs from my reply to you,
and you missed out the most important points....

I (David) wrote:-

"all those precious metals do exist, because you've seen or
heard tell of them" - snip- "you must have been looking in the
wrong place"

you (nuked) wrote:

>i wrote that post in earnest (and i can't find Ms Tiger's email
>i am so lame still...) However drunken stupor or not

Are you lame Nuked? Or drunk in charge of a keyboard again?

I'm not aware of a "Ms Tiger" in the context of this discussion.
I imagine you are referring to Saber aka Miss Stress who has
replied to you several times recently, see the links here:-

u4ds.com/2009/02/dominant_woman_only_in_a_drunk.shtml#c006201

http://u4ds.com/2009/01/femdom_seeking_male.shtml#c006110

http://u4ds.com/2009/03/fantasy_is_fun.shtml#c006185

Of course if it's a tiger you a looking for, you can see some
pics here:-

http://www.google.com/search?q=Saber+toothed+tiger

But that kind of Saber is now extinct. ;-)

To email a real Saber (aka Miss Stress), I suggest you take a
look at the page you posted a message to Ms Saber on, as the
email is given at least twice on her ad at:-

http://u4ds.com/2009/01/femdom_seeking_male.shtml

you (nuked) wrote:

>I don't think kink (Dominant Women definition should be
>discussed here) is really fair for most Women.

That's a different subject entirely Nuked. Probably two
different subjects. Why don't you start different and more
sensible threads? Perhaps they could be entitled:-

"Is kink really fair for most Women?"

"Dominant Women definition needed"

you (nuked) wrote:

>Even professional Dommes are in great need to be accepted

Professional Dommes is yet another subject. And I suggest that
you could open another thread again to discuss your broad and it
seems to me rather silly generalisation as follows:-

you (nuked) wrote:

>it is not what they want or love, they are hard about love
>because they were hurt. They claim power but it is not their
>true love,

Surely you don't contend that those statements apply to all
"professional Dommes"? I'm sure there must be quite a few who
are neither "hard about love" or "were hurt".

Are you perhaps discussing one or two people you have met and
are generalising that those experiences apply to everybody?

>like any of us..... and like all men they need to love.

I don't see why you feel that love and domination/submission are
mutually exclusive. Surely the reading of DOMestic over the last
13 years has taught you that for many (if not most) of us here
it is all about loving domination and submission.

I'm sure there are some professional Dommes out there who both
love their work and who give loving domination to their clients.
Just as there are some who do not.

>So again i say there is no such thing as a dominant woman.

And that statement is demonstrably wrong, and just plain
silliness. If you were not such a long term reader of DOMestic
we would have dismissed your remark that there is "no such thing
as a dominant woman" as just flame bait.

Women obviously come in many types. Some of those types include
three or four of those that you are perhaps getting a bit
confused about. Kinky women, dominant women, and dominant kinky
women. There are lots of other types, and obviously there are
women who are neither dominant nor kinky,

Which type are you looking for? Kinky? Dominant? And yes there
are even dominantly kinky women and kinkily dominant women out
there.

If you read some of the replies to your message here at:-

http://u4ds.com/2009/02/dominant_woman_only_in_a_drunk.shtml

you will see that a few dominant women have already disagreed
with your statement that there is "no such thing as a dominant
woman".

sincerely,
David at u4ds.com

The DOMestic discussion list. Now in our thirteenth year. The
password site now has over 6,700 files with well over 400
stories, plus pictures, and hundreds of articles. $26.99 for a
one year password. $16.99 for six months at

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Re: C: fantasy is fun
Date: Mon, 9 Mar 2009 10:12:19 -0700 (PDT)
From: Miss Stress (Saber)

nuked potatoes wrote:

>Mmmm but reality is different, especially for men :-)

Yes, reality is different - for everyone vs fantasy

>The real thing is love. What i have always heard at this site
>is communication with Your lover.

That is true, communication is essential to *any* relationship,
be it vanilla or cinnamon.

>geocities.com/nuked_potatoes/

I'll have to check out your website.

>"Be Yourself; Everyone else is taken." - Oscar Wilde

LOL! I love that tag line. :)

Saber

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S: Anniversary Surprise - Chapter Eleven
From: Shoekisser
Date: Thu, 15 Jan 2009 22:48:56 +0000

First chapter is at:-
http://u4ds.com/2008/11/anniversary_surprise.shtml

Anniversary Surprise

Chapter Eleven

The next morning she had me up and dressed in the maids dress
early to clean up from the party. Monday was a work day, but she
had me call and say I was sick. My bosses' assistant answered
the phone. She had been at the party, and laughed when I said I
was sick.

"I'll bet you are staying home to clean house. And I'll bet you
are appropriately attired. Tell me what you are wearing."

My wife was listening on the extension, and indicated that I
should comply.

"I'm wearing a black bra, black waist cincher, black hose, and
black patent heels with my maid's dress."

"What about panties? Are you wearing panties?"

"No"

I got zapped.

"No, Mistress."

"Why not?"

"Because my wife hasn't decided if I'm worthy of wearing
panties."

I had previously noticed a pattern develop. Starting two nights
before we were going to host a party, she would refuse my
request for sex. "I want you to be nice and horny the night of
the party." So I usually tried 3 nights before the party. She
knew what I was doing, but didn't object.

So, by Sunday night, I hadn't had any relief since Wednesday,
and the events of the past few days had resulted in a lot of
sexual frustration.

By Monday night I was ready to climb the walls. Lying awake, I
heard her breathing get regular, indicating she was asleep. I
very quietly rolled over onto my stomach, and rubbed against the
mattress, trying to get relief.

"What do you think you are doing?" accompanied by a severe jolt.

I immediately rolled onto my back and pled innocent.

"Well, if you want to have sex on your stomach, we can arrange
it."

She went to the closet, and got out her black leather corset and
put it on. Then black, knee-high, high heel boots, that I hadn't
seen before. I wondered when she had bought them, and whether it
was in anticipation of what was about to happen. Did she know I
would rebel and it would come to this? Finally, she attached the
dildo.

"If it's sex you want, then it's sex you'll get. Up on your
knees", punctuated by the zapper.

I struggled to comply.

She climbed on my back, pulled up my nighty, and skewered me
with the dildo. She wasn't at all gentle, and, in fact, seemed
to be consciously trying to hurt me. She succeeded.

"You have been very disobedient, and have been asking for this.
I can see we will have to do this on a regular basis. In fact,
we may re institute this part of the wedding ceremony in our
meetings, so it can be witnessed by the women you work with. Is
that what you want?"

I risked a zap by saying it, but I felt I must reply with, "No,
Mistress."

Instead of a zap I got a, "Then shape up or I'll do it. In the
mean time, you need to be punished for your outburst. What was
it you said, 'This nonsense has to stop?'..", accompanied by a
jolt. "..'There are going to be some changes made around
here?..", another jolt.

"You are right. Obviously, I haven't made your appearance
feminine enough. As a result, you've gotten too many macho
ideas. We'll fix that starting tomorrow. You will start wearing
a bra, waist cincher, and hose to work, and everywhere else, for
that matter. You will look more feminine at all times."

Tuesday morning, she had me shower, then put on a black bra,
waist cincher, and hose.

"I'm tempted to send you off to work without panties under your
pants."

Fearing that a possible erection would be obvious without
panties, I said. "Please don't do that."

"OK. but the next time you screw up, I will. Put on these
panties. I bought you a new shirt and tie to wear."

The shirt turned out to be a woman's shirt, that was white with
pale pink stripes. It was very tight, particularly across my
padded boobs. The tie was pink with black stylized MTs, the
ManTran logo.

"No socks, just put your shoes on over the hose."

When I was dressed she eyed me critically. "That's better, but
those shoes are too masculine. We'll have to take you shopping
for some more suitable shoes"

So I went to work among the women who had seen me dressed over
the weekend. They all, of course noticed the black bra showing
through the too tight shirt, and my ankles covered by black
hose. I got numerous remarks about my attire.

That night, after work, we met, and went shopping for shoes, in
a women's store, of course. The pair she selected weren't too
feminine, loafers, but definitely women's, with a 2" heel. We
stopped at a shoe repair store to have plates installed on the
heels so "You'll sound like a woman in heels, and people will
hear you coming."

* * * end of messages * * *

The DOMestic discussion list. Now in our thirteenth year. The
password site now has over 6,700 files with well over 400
stories, plus pictures, and hundreds of articles. $26.99 for a
one year password. $16.99 for six months at:-

http://u4ds.com/password

The Fem Dom Training Program.
Warning! Turns your wife/lover into a Dominatrix
http://u4ds.com/program

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